Is AEW Growing? + Why WrestleMania 42 Ticket Sales Are Slowing | Takedown

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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, Paul, we are back with the takedown.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I know you want to talk about some WWE things.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And we'll save that for the second part of the show because what I want to open up with, I actually want to ask you, if you believe that AEW is really back on the upswing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think it's a really good conversation to have right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The thing for both of us, the reason why we can talk about this is because we watch and enjoy and criticize and praise both products.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So both promotions were not, you know, we're not, we're not the tribalistic kind of fan.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think it's like, I can't have the same conversation

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[SPEAKER_00]: with John the Rock because he just doesn't like the AEW product to that much.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There are things about that product that drive him nuts as an old school wrestling booker mentality.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But.

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[SPEAKER_00]: you and I are just viewers and we're just critics.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so the conversation around the booking, Tony Khan, having all of these contenders that seemingly has raised some of the interest in the show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then I think this kind of got buried in the news, but last, the world's end paper

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[SPEAKER_00]: like, it was the, I think it did like 140,000 or something like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I mean, that, yeah, and that one, I mean, you say that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it was only the fourth paper view since all in.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, I mean, it was a second out of four.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you know, so I mean, but that was a December late December.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm not trying to, and yeah, the date was terrible.

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[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of those collisions were all out of order and on funky schedules and the why I wasn't, you know, which is why it wasn't as big of a fan of that tournament as a lot of folks work.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, I can't watch this stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's Christmas time in like holiday season takes priority.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But so there are there are some small indicators.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Um, that they're, you know, I think from a business perspective, some of that stuff is pretty strong and it's just consistent and just shows that they have created a nice little fan base for a hardcore fans.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now, the ratings is so hard to really like dig into and understand and the numbers are wonky and then we have max and we're not sure what max is and people will say,

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, we don't know what Max is, but then Dave will give some wacky number and I'm like, what, like, how can Max be this?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then WWE on Netflix is this.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It just doesn't measure up for me, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: But.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But do you believe that there is renewed interest in AEW and maybe interest that they haven't seen in in a little while like I don't I don't know if it's real I mean it there there's something where I feel like the TV is better and you and I've had that conversation like I think these last three or four weeks has been really consistent and really strong television.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But that doesn't, you know, but you look at the houses and it really doesn't say that anything is changed, but what do you think about where they are?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's funny you had this up because I didn't know before we started recording.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And if you sometimes ask me for a couple different topics and this actually would have been the second one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, that I've been interested in because I've been thinking about this a lot.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, okay, so when you jump from a 0.09 to a 0.15 in one week,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like that just immediately sets off alarm bells, like, okay, is this, is this accurate or are they just measuring things differently you made a comment on observer radio and I totally agreed with it and actually had the exact same thought where you said it feels almost like they're making up numbers to make people feel good and yeah, I mean, that's the initial thought, but then, you know, like right away I'm like, okay, let's just pretend like, okay, that's probably not true, right, but

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[SPEAKER_01]: I looked back and I went back to before they changed everything in October.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I looked at the week ending September 24th, which was the week before big data came in.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I looked at the 10 week average before that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and it was a 0.15 and 613,000 overall viewers, which is like what they did last week, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It is the exact same 18 to 49 and they did a little bit more in overall viewers last week, because they did 654.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So 40,000 more overall the same 18 to 49.

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[SPEAKER_01]: they have not gone over, they did a 0.15 for one show and that was grandson Mexico in November and they did 600,000 overall.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So around the same number, but everything other than that, since they changed the system has been 0.10 or less.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And most weeks, I mean, it hasn't even hit 0.1 very often.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's most weeks, it's been 0.08 or 0.09.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and all of a sudden they're 0.15.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think what's happened is they're basically gone back to what they were doing before somehow.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, because I mean, if you look at it, big data has absolutely no way to measure 18 to 49.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like they, if you look at how big data is figured, like it can't, it can't figure out who's watching.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It can tell you exactly how many people are watching,

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[SPEAKER_01]: So they're having to use the estimates based on the panel, the panel numbers, in order to estimate what the big data viewership might be.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And the problem is, is those systems are designed for regular television.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And wrestling traditionally has not had the same kind of demographics as regular television, a lot younger, skewing, you know, when you get into ethnicities and stuff, there's a lot more

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[SPEAKER_01]: That'll say, that's not the question you ask.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I do think it does feel like they're that they do have some momentum.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I can tell you first hand knowledge.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I brought this up in the discord.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I have a friend who has not watched a W in almost two years.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And when he heard about Mosul Champa jumping, he heard that it was a really good segment and he decided to check out the show.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's not so much that Champa is like his favorite wrestling or anything like that, but it's you know, it's intriguing when someone jumps from one company to the other.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and then he watched the collision after because Elchomp was going to be wrestling for a belt.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So he watched first time he'd ever watched collision and then he liked that show.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So he watched this past week's Dynamite.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then he texted me on Sunday morning.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Did you watch Collision?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, what, you watch Collision again?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, yeah, he's like, I, you know, Trump was gonna be wrestling again.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I like Roddy, I like Tomasso, I like Claudio.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I figured yeah, I'll check that show out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And he was like, you know, braiding a woman's match.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I thought, you know, is this Loraca?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, like speaking about berating the women's match.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh, the Monday night raw triple threat match with Rhea.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That might be the worst Rhea match I've seen in quite one time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I didn't think it was a very good match.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Apparently there's like one botch.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I kind of missed it because I was I was dealing with all this stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I was talking to you about our fair.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So I can tell you what the botch was and it wasn't even a bad one.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, at least that I remember was Lyra and was trying to get on Rhea's shoulders.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And they couldn't do it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then Lyra.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If she had figured it out like two seconds prior, it would have been smooth as hell, but you could see that she had to stop and go, okay, how are we going to do this?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then they did it in a different way, but there was almost a disastrous part.

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[SPEAKER_00]: there was a suplex spot where they almost suplexed one of the women onto the head of the other woman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And they missed by like a foot.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was I like almost that must be the one that that must be the one my friend texted me about because he said there's a spot in the corner where I be went off the top rope and they completely mistimed it and it looked atrocious.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well yeah that okay that was the follow up after after live so the reason why

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[SPEAKER_00]: Lira gets on re-ish shoulders so that Ivy can do that move, but Rea falls forward too quickly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So Ivy basically bulldogged nobody off the top rope.

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[SPEAKER_00]: She just like fell, like just jumped off herself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, that match doesn't have that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But um, no, but yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I do think like I do think they do have some momentum.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that there is more people watching.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I do, I wonder, is it possible that they actually are counting HBO Max now?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm wondering that too, but, you know, because at some point they're gonna, and I don't know if they're gonna tell us, I, I, I, I asked Dave that, I know you didn't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: On there, and he was like at some point and I said, well, they'd better do it soon, because do how long is this thing going to be on HBO Max for all we know?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, and that's the thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And when they do, are they going to tell us they did?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Or is it just going to be like, oh, yeah, numbers have been up for a couple of weeks because they started adding HBO Max.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, but it's funny because I mean, yeah, you look at these numbers and you look at TNA and they, you know, they had their best number and I haven't seen the SmackDown number yet, but it's probably going to be up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Brian and Dave are actually Dave basically called that TNA number that came out yesterday.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He basically called it fake.

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[SPEAKER_01]: which is ridiculous, then you can't do that and then say, oh, but collisions went out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what he said was, and this is interesting.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And this is him sort of understanding numbers, these numbers to a level that I don't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He said, when you get to around 200,000, that's where the sample stuff is just so wonky that you can't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, L.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so what he did is, you know, he's using these Google search numbers, like even more now these days, and he says what the what the measuring stick for him is usually, if he sees an increase in numbers, and then he sees a Google search that correlates in an increase, then he kind of thinks that, okay, that's probably right, but he said there was no Google increase in TNA and it was actually going the other way for

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's got a point in the sense that, you know, like when you're talking about 200 and, you know, whatever they did the week before 21 and now it's like 241.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's not really that much.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you're talking about two people.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it's, it's funny, but you know, like clearly the new way they're doing it again is to I do think that there's probably something like, you know, it's not that they're making up numbers, but it's like, okay, we got to figure out something to shut these wrestling people out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, okay, so now from

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[SPEAKER_00]: And we've talked a little bit about the data side, but what about your feeling on the overall booking?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because I mean, yeah, really about creating stars.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it's really about raising the level of specific talent.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And they are very much trying with with Brody, which I'm not sure that's the guy I would necessarily try with, but they're trying with him.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They're trying with Andre

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[SPEAKER_00]: They are still, they're still using Hangman in an interesting way that I just wish that they would run.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I just wish that they would go all in on Hangman, but for whatever reason they don't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And they're kind of using MJF as the vehicle to do all of these things.

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[SPEAKER_00]: MJF and Kenny Omega essentially, but I think it's, I think it's interesting.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like to me,

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[SPEAKER_00]: AEW has been such a dream match promotion that every time they tease a match that I want to see and then it doesn't happen.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I get super disappointed, but maybe it's better for the big picture that they do with that way, because Kenny Omega losing to on draw day to set up the match against hangman like I was like, oh, Megan, hangman, that's going to be awesome.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then they're like, nope, you have to wait for that one buddy and I'm like, oh,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but you're gonna wait and you're probably gonna get it on paper view.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the same thing with MJF and Kenny.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the only time we saw that match was on a collision.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, and so a lot of people probably didn't see it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I know I agree because I've made this comment like every week on the dynamite show ever since MJF won the title.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I've been a huge fan of the direction because immediately, MJF first week out, he's a champion and you've got everyone lining up.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you had like on that first show, it was M.J. F. Hangman, Swerve, and Joe are sorry, Hangman, Swerve, Joe, and Kenny all going for the title.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Then they added Brody.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You kind of got flexured in the background that, you know, he's going for the TNT title, but he's kind of got that eye on the world title too.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, Brody seems more like this is like we're just going to keep him busy until we're going to keep MJF busy until the big show, but you know, they're trying I didn't like as much as a lot of people did what they did last week, you know, I didn't think that really help Brody at all.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But a lot of people liked it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it really doesn't matter what I think.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It really only matters whether or not the their fans believe that he is.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The part that I didn't like is they should have went.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The show should have ended with him raising his hand in the ring.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, wouldn't need to do that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Or you could have done like rather than have hangmen be involved at all.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you could have had MJF just being all cocky.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe he's distracted by the chance and then Brody a John brought this up, and I brought it up before I heard John say it, you know, and then Brody just blitz his him, you know, like he takes his off the ball and and then you can have hangman come out after that and start like laughing at him.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, like look what you just did or whatever and then maybe even Brody stands up to hangman says, hey, I beat this guy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, like, and, and you, you might be facing me now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That would be good.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That didn't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then all of a sudden, you're like, Oh, shit.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This guy actually beat bro.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Because this one, you remember M. J. F. lost to Lee Johnson.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Did he ever?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Three or four years ago, and it was similar to this.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Only that time because it was Lee Johnson, like everybody knew, oh, this is, you know, this is just mjf, you know, sip on a banana peel, give somebody a win.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it tells you how effective it was if I didn't even remember.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, no, because it was part of a bigger feud that you just have with word low.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And in this case, it's part of a feudies happen with hangman and or on draw day and or omega.

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[SPEAKER_01]: and or Omega.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, Omega at this point now is probably third down that list.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, but Amy, he's there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, they're going to do the match.

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[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, did you hear you heard Observer Radio from Sunday when they when they did the Sunday one, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think I think that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm listening.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I may have finished it, but I know they're listening to at least most of them.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They talked about the fuck ice chance that we're on the show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then Dave said something about, do you want those chance to happen or not?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then he said, because the big boss.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Why do you mean by the big boss that he means Donald Trump?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, because he would say if you're WWE, would you want those chance that that's what he was saying and Trump is yeah, the big boss of WWE.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, I heard that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I thought about

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[SPEAKER_01]: who are the, like, first of all, it's like, okay, why did they chant that?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I guess it's because Brody was in the ring and Brody has Brody's shirt by the way, says abolish ice.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It does not say fuck off, but I think that the crowd kind of turned it into their own thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and it's weird because I didn't even, you know, I, I, I have to think I'm told you off air.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't even hear it.

16:18.846 --> 16:19.627
[SPEAKER_01]: I heard a chant.

16:20.168 --> 16:21.650
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought it was both guys.

16:21.791 --> 16:27.419
[SPEAKER_01]: So I could see how both guys sounds like buff ice, um, you know, you know, kind of the same cadence.

16:27.499 --> 16:33.067
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't until MJF made the face where I was like, oh, that this is not a normal wrestling.

16:33.147 --> 16:33.828
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

16:33.848 --> 16:34.990
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it was like, okay.

16:35.290 --> 16:38.595
[SPEAKER_01]: But now, you know, and I think I think you might have brought it up.

16:39.706 --> 16:41.047
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, maybe it was Brian.

16:41.708 --> 16:44.831
[SPEAKER_01]: The fans sometimes will pick up on that.

16:45.051 --> 16:47.853
[SPEAKER_01]: And now are they going to chant it now at every show?

16:47.873 --> 16:52.658
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think that's the, that's what Dave was wondering is yeah, do they want that?

16:53.018 --> 16:55.781
[SPEAKER_00]: Because by how do you stop there?

16:55.801 --> 16:58.503
[SPEAKER_00]: AEW doesn't necessarily pick sides.

16:58.723 --> 16:59.964
[SPEAKER_00]: The company doesn't pick sides.

16:59.984 --> 17:02.847
[SPEAKER_00]: The wrestlers sometimes may speak out about certain things.

17:03.307 --> 17:08.532
[SPEAKER_00]: But the other thing about that, and this is what I, what I liked about it.

17:10.317 --> 17:11.499
[SPEAKER_00]: we wrestling fans.

17:12.922 --> 17:20.214
[SPEAKER_00]: People like to say things about us and I was very happy that that crowd was basically like, yeah, we know what's going on.

17:20.735 --> 17:29.811
[SPEAKER_00]: We know this is our fake wrestling, but we are going to utilize this moment to let us, you know, for us to voice our disprovenant

17:29.791 --> 17:41.147
[SPEAKER_00]: Wrestling promotions really want fans to be any sports, you know thing right any any sports entity where you you bring in fans to root for the game You don't want them to bring different things to the game.

17:41.167 --> 17:42.489
[SPEAKER_00]: You want them to focus on the game.

17:42.529 --> 17:45.273
[SPEAKER_00]: So this isn't just wrestling, but so that's what I liked about it.

17:45.293 --> 17:46.295
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, wrestling fans.

17:46.315 --> 17:49.299
[SPEAKER_00]: You guys show your smart show you know what's going on in this world.

17:49.339 --> 17:55.528
[SPEAKER_00]: So I thought that part of it was cool, but if it becomes What's going to happen and I think this is more to your point.

17:56.183 --> 18:08.658
[SPEAKER_00]: if you, if this chant keeps happening, the chant may start to be the heel and people may start getting annoyed and then it loses its effective rest.

18:08.678 --> 18:13.624
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and if Tony tries to get them to stop, they're just gonna do it louder.

18:14.264 --> 18:17.388
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, you can't stop it.

18:17.708 --> 18:25.077
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what if Tony, what if Tony starts here in the chant and he starts doing the Daniel Garcia dance down the ramp?

18:25.057 --> 18:26.058
[SPEAKER_00]: Did you hear?

18:26.119 --> 18:28.222
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you hear what happened on the UFC show?

18:28.782 --> 18:29.503
[SPEAKER_01]: You probably didn't.

18:29.523 --> 18:30.925
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't because I didn't watch it.

18:30.966 --> 18:42.402
[SPEAKER_01]: So Dustin Jacobi late heavyweight got a big win and he does this promo and he says I support all law enforcement in this country.

18:42.442 --> 18:43.884
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we have great leadership.

18:44.124 --> 18:51.435
[SPEAKER_01]: I think President Trump is doing a great job and I would love to have around a golf with him and I would be honored to fight on that White House show

18:52.073 --> 19:04.058
[SPEAKER_01]: camera who was interviewing him, but the guy did not like the comments like you could tell and they like they all embrace Trump, but when he said I embrace all law and for you knew what he was talking about.

19:04.078 --> 19:04.860
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

19:04.880 --> 19:10.652
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that and but then there's also the grift piece of it at the end because why is he sucking up so hard?

19:10.752 --> 19:12.917
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, because he wants to be on this show, but then.

19:12.897 --> 19:17.609
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, who was the person somebody said there's only going to be like seven or eight fights on it.

19:17.889 --> 19:25.187
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and and I mean, theoretically they're all going to be title fights or at the very least like maybe not title fights, but the big big stars.

19:25.388 --> 19:28.375
[SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, so that's what Jacobi may not make the good.

19:28.355 --> 19:42.656
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you know that that was a that was a hard that was a very hard grift for him to to try Yeah, and you know, and and you know, and I do believe I keep I mean, there's a lot of these fighters that just love that guy I don't know why but You know, I mean, I think it gets them over.

19:42.716 --> 19:49.806
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why they think well, were they really like them and you know, and that's a thing like Yeah, like you could like somebody a lot

19:49.786 --> 19:53.438
[SPEAKER_00]: put to go out of your way to kiss their ass.

19:53.618 --> 20:01.804
[SPEAKER_01]: I would hope that there's some strategy behind it rather than just play funny thing is you think Trump's watching, you know, fight night from the apex.

20:02.054 --> 20:27.353
[SPEAKER_01]: probably do Trump was supposed to be watching Kid Rock and at based on his post he was definitely watching Bad Bunny yeah well that that was the right choice I if anything is like I like Kid Rock I'm not gonna lie I don't like his politics I hate his politics but I like his music and and I don't know any bad bunny music but that and that performance was great like I didn't know any of the songs but I didn't care like I knew what was going on I could tell like

20:27.333 --> 20:29.737
[SPEAKER_01]: He told a great story, symbolize the media.

20:29.857 --> 20:30.539
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was amazing.

20:30.559 --> 20:31.921
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was incredible.

20:32.562 --> 20:34.145
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's such a great performer.

20:34.245 --> 20:38.733
[SPEAKER_01]: So, but yeah, yeah, I do think like some it all up.

20:38.753 --> 20:40.175
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do think that there is.

20:40.255 --> 20:41.457
[SPEAKER_01]: They do have some momentum.

20:41.698 --> 20:43.982
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll be very interested to see what the next paper view does.

20:44.703 --> 20:47.308
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll be really interested with this collision does on Saturday.

20:47.588 --> 20:52.817
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's an interesting one because now I always

20:53.607 --> 21:12.055
[SPEAKER_00]: Whenever there's these like real world things happening or these holidays or like I was saying with the, you know, the Christmas holiday, I almost don't want this number to be great because I'm like, would the hell are you wrestling fans doing like go hang out with your friends and your family and it like, but

21:12.338 --> 21:15.882
[SPEAKER_00]: It could show that, you know, people are just super intrigued in the show.

21:15.902 --> 21:23.009
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, I will watch it eventually at some point probably Sunday, but I'll probably watch it Saturday now because I'm like the trip god cancel.

21:23.350 --> 21:24.030
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

21:24.050 --> 21:25.512
[SPEAKER_01]: And we don't celebrate Valentine's Day.

21:25.832 --> 21:28.075
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you remember when WWE did a paper going Valentine's Day?

21:28.435 --> 21:30.818
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this is what I was thinking about Valentine's Day.

21:30.918 --> 21:31.999
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, do you remember what it was?

21:32.019 --> 21:35.322
[SPEAKER_00]: 1999 Vince McMahon and this big show, right?

21:35.342 --> 21:36.844
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, that was where they did the big show debut.

21:36.864 --> 21:37.905
[SPEAKER_00]: Big show comes in.

21:38.225 --> 21:41.569
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

21:42.460 --> 22:03.557
[SPEAKER_00]: Big show being the biggest doofus in the history of WWE starts on this show because he pulls the cage off, which allows Austin to come out and win the match, yeah, but that was a huge match and I didn't buy rate was disappointing, yeah, and it was Vincent Stone Cold, which theoretically should have done a really good number.

22:03.537 --> 22:08.884
[SPEAKER_01]: So if they would have put that on, you know, on on the March paper viewer, you know, April or something.

22:08.904 --> 22:11.307
[SPEAKER_01]: They probably, I think the March paper view was real so many.

22:11.327 --> 22:11.407
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

22:11.467 --> 22:11.667
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

22:11.687 --> 22:14.691
[SPEAKER_00]: It was the, it was the only paper view between rumble and many of that.

22:14.751 --> 22:14.911
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

22:14.931 --> 22:20.539
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was coming off him and Vince being one and two and then going all the way, which yeah.

22:20.699 --> 22:22.421
[SPEAKER_00]: And that number being down.

22:22.942 --> 22:24.043
[SPEAKER_00]: I was kind of like.

22:24.530 --> 22:44.361
[SPEAKER_00]: Good job people go spend time with your significant other or whatever and by the way, I don't want it to sound like everybody has someone to spend this day with that is why other stuff goes on if you don't or if that's not your thing and you just want to watch your wrestling like normal so that more power to you, but I'm just saying.

22:44.341 --> 22:50.369
[SPEAKER_00]: there's a little bit of like sicko hubris going on by putting the show on Valentine's Day.

22:50.389 --> 23:01.264
[SPEAKER_01]: I think what you're saying is you would prefer if the typical AEW fan wasn't the stereotypical sitting alone in your basement, you know, watch a lot of stuff.

23:01.284 --> 23:07.733
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you'd rather it be like couples and families and whatever watching and those people got better things to do on Valentine's.

23:07.713 --> 23:12.180
[SPEAKER_00]: And look, there is going to be that fan who's just going to be super dialed in.

23:12.200 --> 23:12.280
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

23:12.300 --> 23:14.043
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to judge that person.

23:14.123 --> 23:19.652
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying how the rest of the world judges, yes, first and as a wrestling fan.

23:19.672 --> 23:25.341
[SPEAKER_00]: That is a stereotype that wrestling fans have been unable to shake for the life of us.

23:25.901 --> 23:29.066
[SPEAKER_00]: And that I would just like to say, hey, that's not wrestling fans.

23:29.287 --> 23:32.011
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd love to hear, you know, the show did a disappointing live number.

23:32.091 --> 23:34.274
[SPEAKER_01]: But man, those PBR numbers are off the road.

23:34.295 --> 23:35.897
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.

23:35.877 --> 23:37.700
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so I'm kind of with you.

23:37.720 --> 23:53.924
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there's something here, but now let's dovetail into this WWE story because I think one of the things that we are all watching for is to see if WWE can keep up the business of the last two or three years.

23:54.945 --> 23:59.292
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're always looking for science to see, ooh, that thing happened.

23:59.312 --> 24:00.954
[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if that's going to hurt them.

24:02.236 --> 24:04.399
[SPEAKER_00]: There are science to me.

24:04.379 --> 24:12.789
[SPEAKER_00]: That says WWE may be slipping a little bit, and that could also accentuate AEW, right?

24:12.809 --> 24:14.171
[SPEAKER_00]: Because that's what happened the first time.

24:14.652 --> 24:22.381
[SPEAKER_00]: WWE was failing AEW was the fresh alternative, and then they rose, and then they got CM Punk, and then they rose even more.

24:22.822 --> 24:25.705
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, again, I'm not saying, what was WWE?

24:25.725 --> 24:32.614
[SPEAKER_00]: They're still so strong, and a lot of the key indicators, but what we have learned in the past is that sometimes,

24:32.594 --> 24:36.542
[SPEAKER_00]: It can just be this rock tumbling down a hill and you can't really stop it.

24:38.125 --> 24:40.710
[SPEAKER_00]: The one thing that I thought about.

24:40.751 --> 24:48.426
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, with this is based on the observer, Dave is writing about the WrestleMania planch changing.

24:49.250 --> 24:53.796
[SPEAKER_00]: and they're being heat on triple H, which I thought was pretty interesting.

24:53.917 --> 25:04.091
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the triple H that we are shown on WWE unreal is this genius mastermind who everybody loves.

25:04.872 --> 25:06.955
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, he does hold that hug on.

25:07.357 --> 25:10.322
[SPEAKER_00]: some of the women talent a little longer than I would like him to.

25:11.264 --> 25:15.030
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, he is like really close to a lot of those, those wrestlers, right?

25:15.050 --> 25:27.913
[SPEAKER_00]: That's part of the gig is, you have to be decisive on making decisions about these people.

25:27.893 --> 25:34.342
[SPEAKER_00]: if there's heat on him, it should be on him if you're talking about creative because he's the guy.

25:34.983 --> 25:41.071
[SPEAKER_00]: But I found that comment to be kind of interesting because they are changing things up with the Russell Maniacard.

25:41.091 --> 25:43.835
[SPEAKER_00]: They haven't been as finite.

25:43.915 --> 25:48.501
[SPEAKER_00]: And some of this happens last year, right, when we think that the rock is going to be involved,

25:48.481 --> 25:55.589
[SPEAKER_00]: And do the rock can't get Cody to turn heel with him because that was something he was invested in and that he was going to sink his teeth into.

25:56.129 --> 25:58.852
[SPEAKER_00]: And instead it was seen and he was like, all right, guys, I did my job.

25:58.932 --> 25:59.553
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll see you later.

25:59.633 --> 25:59.994
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm out.

26:00.454 --> 26:00.794
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not.

26:01.595 --> 26:02.316
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't get my way.

26:02.336 --> 26:02.877
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm out.

26:03.598 --> 26:10.245
[SPEAKER_00]: And now, I don't think they're going to have him this year either to kind of pull things back together in the way that only he can.

26:10.665 --> 26:12.227
[SPEAKER_00]: So they're really

26:12.207 --> 26:16.356
[SPEAKER_00]: having to figure out this WrestleMania card and what the rest of this year looks like.

26:16.797 --> 26:18.019
[SPEAKER_00]: Now there's also news.

26:18.881 --> 26:21.146
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is not predictable in any way.

26:21.186 --> 26:22.067
[SPEAKER_00]: This is just bad luck.

26:22.729 --> 26:30.064
[SPEAKER_00]: Bron Braker, Dave reported today that he could be out like

26:30.314 --> 26:45.572
[SPEAKER_00]: four months or six months, which means he misses Rossomania, which means the Seth Rollins angle that they've been building and building and building and we're building last night too on Mananera could be changed now.

26:45.974 --> 26:51.621
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe Brock Brown breakers just a super freak athlete, and he can come back much sooner than everybody else.

26:51.641 --> 26:59.871
[SPEAKER_00]: But the story is, is that the hernia surgery that he got was the more invasive one, which is why it's going to take him out much longer.

27:00.271 --> 27:06.279
[SPEAKER_00]: So there are just little things that we're watching that go, oh man, this sucks, because I know that they wanted to do that.

27:07.060 --> 27:09.703
[SPEAKER_00]: They changed to punk and Roman Reigns.

27:09.683 --> 27:22.377
[SPEAKER_00]: And in doing that, there are also trying to build up this fin baller match for elimination chamber and what I saw in Monday was Finn, you are clearly a B-level player.

27:22.829 --> 27:29.221
[SPEAKER_00]: But you had a good match and so we're going to give the fans that match again, but Adam Pierce is like, no, not going to have it.

27:29.341 --> 27:30.864
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to jeopardize WrestleMania.

27:30.904 --> 27:34.471
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, well, what if Finn wins, then maybe Finn and Roman is a match.

27:34.491 --> 27:41.444
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, why don't you present it as that instead of there's no way this match happens because I don't worry about it.

27:41.464 --> 27:41.985
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm winning.

27:41.965 --> 27:46.394
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the mere chant that Finn wins, it ruins WrestleMania.

27:46.975 --> 27:51.886
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like I was like, what, that's how you're building your elimination chamber title match.

27:51.906 --> 27:53.128
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that was ridiculous.

27:53.148 --> 27:54.271
[SPEAKER_01]: He's been in Finn and Roman.

27:54.291 --> 27:58.159
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a rematch of the first ever universal championship final.

27:58.219 --> 28:00.143
[SPEAKER_00]: Finn called back to that, too.

28:00.243 --> 28:01.105
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

28:01.085 --> 28:05.909
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I was really happy when he did that because that was the first thing I thought of.

28:06.290 --> 28:13.756
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I know you wanted to talk about kind of rustle-making of the softness in the- And it was kind of, I know, kind of what you were talking about there.

28:13.816 --> 28:21.123
[SPEAKER_01]: And first of all, like, I do think that there is something to the fact that, okay, if you look back a year ago, yeah, they did make some last minute changes.

28:21.203 --> 28:25.707
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think everybody knew, we're going to see Cody and scene at Mania.

28:26.268 --> 28:31.092
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to see Roman in the other main event and he's probably going to be against

28:31.072 --> 28:33.114
[SPEAKER_01]: and it ended up being both of them.

28:33.134 --> 28:41.002
[SPEAKER_01]: So in that sense, you basically had two main events that were set, whether or not they were actually booked on paper, you knew they were coming.

28:41.022 --> 28:46.748
[SPEAKER_01]: So people that were buying tickets, four or five months out, new, okay, we're gonna get, we're gonna get seen as last WrestleMania match.

28:46.908 --> 28:48.230
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the big draw right there.

28:49.011 --> 28:50.792
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you know, we're just probably gonna be facing code.

28:50.812 --> 28:54.736
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, Vegas, year one, was a big draw as well.

28:55.197 --> 28:59.121
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and Vegas, year two, not as big of a draw.

28:59.101 --> 28:59.562
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

28:59.682 --> 29:08.825
[SPEAKER_01]: And you, I think they may have been relying on the fact that people were going to come knowing that it was the last WrestleMania before Saudi.

29:09.246 --> 29:13.255
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like, you better get in now because you're not going to be able to see one for two years.

29:13.837 --> 29:15.962
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think people are thinking like that.

29:15.942 --> 29:23.171
[SPEAKER_01]: They're also missing out on international travel because a lot of people from other countries do not want to go to the United States right now.

29:24.452 --> 29:26.475
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm experiencing my own family.

29:26.915 --> 29:36.487
[SPEAKER_01]: I know so many other Canadians and also people from Europe that used to go to many every year that aren't going, like they just do not want to travel to the States.

29:36.967 --> 29:38.229
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that they're afraid.

29:38.489 --> 29:45.257
[SPEAKER_01]: It's they don't

29:45.777 --> 30:00.492
[SPEAKER_00]: But something that is a real world thing that I'm very happy that not not that people don't even come to WrestleMania, but that people are aware, you know, like, like, this this goes against the booger eaters in the basement, right?

30:00.552 --> 30:02.537
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is real life stuff happening.

30:02.517 --> 30:07.224
[SPEAKER_01]: Sure, and so like, you know, even us like we had an option we had a family trip plan.

30:07.284 --> 30:19.902
[SPEAKER_01]: It was canceled I was looking at other options and the cheapest option anywhere in the world to go would be Vegas other than where we were already booked and everyone's like I should say everyone.

30:19.882 --> 30:21.446
[SPEAKER_01]: a lot of the family was nope.

30:21.727 --> 30:24.114
[SPEAKER_01]: We're not going like call me in three years.

30:24.475 --> 30:24.755
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

30:24.956 --> 30:27.122
[SPEAKER_01]: Four or two years or whatever, he's going to be gone.

30:27.784 --> 30:28.967
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, we'll talk then.

30:29.107 --> 30:31.995
[SPEAKER_01]: But, um, so, you know, that it was just not even an option.

30:32.597 --> 30:34.903
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, and for me, like I don't,

30:34.883 --> 30:43.477
[SPEAKER_01]: because I don't have any morals that way, like I don't like it, but I also like going to Vegas, and I like my wrestling, and I like hanging out with the people in the convention and stuff.

30:43.497 --> 30:46.061
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm in-depth going to Mania.

30:46.982 --> 30:55.396
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I think a lot of people at this point, and then you have the high ticket prices, and I haven't looked at the prices, I'm going to guess their higher than they were last year.

30:55.717 --> 30:56.418
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think so.

30:56.818 --> 30:58.301
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, those will come down.

30:58.321 --> 31:02.207
[SPEAKER_01]: I do think

31:02.187 --> 31:06.255
[SPEAKER_01]: But probably not at the same gate level that they did last year.

31:06.335 --> 31:07.497
[SPEAKER_01]: That would be my guess.

31:07.517 --> 31:08.038
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

31:08.259 --> 31:16.855
[SPEAKER_00]: If Vince McMahon was still booking and he saw this soft ticket sales for this year.

31:18.944 --> 31:36.733
[SPEAKER_00]: Shane McMahon the undertaker somebody's coming out of retirement stone cold Steve Austin somebody's trying to get him he's uh and so you know now now well I don't think it's Vince probably wouldn't even gone back to me to Vegas I bet I bet you he would have he would have gone to New Orleans

31:36.713 --> 31:38.717
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're probably originally scheduled.

31:38.737 --> 31:42.844
[SPEAKER_01]: He like, I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to give flowers to Vince or anything like that.

31:42.885 --> 31:49.437
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not it's not that it's just Vince, you know, Vince did have a loyalty to the fans in some ways.

31:50.058 --> 31:52.482
[SPEAKER_01]: And if he made a problem, I don't even know if it's the fan part.

31:52.603 --> 31:53.845
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's.

31:54.213 --> 32:12.812
[SPEAKER_01]: he would not want what he would fear right is the second year in a row doing worse than the first because the last time he did that was I believe it was the Trump manious right four and five and six no yeah uh there's four and five four and five four and five and five

32:12.792 --> 32:16.319
[SPEAKER_01]: did not do as well, you know, from what I remember.

32:17.000 --> 32:20.146
[SPEAKER_01]: And that had the biggest match, Hogan and Savage.

32:20.407 --> 32:20.727
[SPEAKER_01]: It did.

32:20.848 --> 32:21.008
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

32:21.028 --> 32:22.611
[SPEAKER_01]: What are the best builds they've ever done?

32:22.992 --> 32:23.152
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

32:23.172 --> 32:24.655
[SPEAKER_00]: It was just a very sleepy.

32:25.076 --> 32:26.919
[SPEAKER_00]: Both of those realsmenis were very sleepy.

32:26.959 --> 32:27.781
[SPEAKER_00]: The environment.

32:27.941 --> 32:28.843
[SPEAKER_00]: It was like,

32:28.823 --> 32:38.057
[SPEAKER_00]: it was like kind of what you would see now at an NBA all-star game or at an NBA game where you know, the first five rows is all rich people who are not really there.

32:38.098 --> 32:39.500
[SPEAKER_00]: They just want to be seen.

32:39.900 --> 32:56.907
[SPEAKER_01]: That was kind of what I was trying to like, you know, week four of one of eight W's Resonancies, you know, where I obviously, it was obviously, I was going to say a lot bigger than that, but I mean, the crowd at the AWS was probably better, but, you know, it's the same kind of thing, like by the week four, you're like a can I don't need to see this anymore.

32:57.207 --> 32:58.829
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it's going to be like that with Mania.

32:58.849 --> 33:02.114
[SPEAKER_01]: They'll probably have a new set and different matches and stuff.

33:02.174 --> 33:07.281
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, it's just WWE isn't as hot as they were a year ago.

33:07.822 --> 33:14.711
[SPEAKER_01]: But one thing I wanted to bring up in regards to this though was Dave made a comment and I initially sluffed it off.

33:15.352 --> 33:16.794
[SPEAKER_01]: And I still think he was wrong.

33:17.615 --> 33:20.599
[SPEAKER_01]: But I started to think like, what if he's right?

33:20.579 --> 33:32.040
[SPEAKER_01]: And what it was was when he was talking about, remember that the promo that happened last week on Raw with Roman and Punk and how they were, you know, badmoth and Drew.

33:32.080 --> 33:37.871
[SPEAKER_01]: And he made the point that SmackDown is their number one show now by far.

33:38.492 --> 33:40.596
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that was exact words.

33:40.576 --> 33:55.430
[SPEAKER_01]: And my initial thought was, he's nuts, like I know that he thinks that, you know, raw has, you know, 700,000 people watching live every week and, you know, which is, you know, almost NXT levels and lower than Dynamite and way lower than SmackDown and all that.

33:55.570 --> 34:00.834
[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm thinking like, you ask any fan of WWE, raw is still the issue.

34:01.555 --> 34:05.238
[SPEAKER_01]: And everybody I talked to, if they watched anything all week, it was raw.

34:05.719 --> 34:06.700
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't SmackDown.

34:06.720 --> 34:08.001
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know,

34:07.981 --> 34:13.250
[SPEAKER_01]: There's very few people I know that watch SmackDown every week and I know a lot of people that watch Raw every week.

34:13.270 --> 34:26.293
[SPEAKER_00]: So I guarantee you, whatever that Raw number is, even if it is lower than the SmackDown number, they are more intentional, they are more actively watching and the SmackDown audience is probably way more passive viewers here.

34:26.273 --> 34:26.854
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

34:27.035 --> 34:32.326
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's just, you know, we're forgetting whether or not, you know, which one has more viewership.

34:32.386 --> 34:38.519
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's also the point of and Dave even conceded this, the 18 to 49 numbers could be higher for raw.

34:38.660 --> 34:45.635
[SPEAKER_00]: That was what I wanted to make sure that he was going to mention because yeah, you know, let's say tells us that the demo is the only thing that matters.

34:45.695 --> 34:47.218
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he talks all about.

34:47.198 --> 34:48.500
[SPEAKER_00]: that you were shooting.

34:48.520 --> 34:52.827
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the viewers chip might be a little bit easier to to kind of guess made.

34:53.168 --> 34:57.014
[SPEAKER_01]: But my thought was, okay, let's say Dave's right.

34:57.034 --> 34:59.599
[SPEAKER_01]: And let's say that SmackDown is the number one show.

35:00.701 --> 35:08.574
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, they're booking their biggest show of the year around two guys wrestling on what would now be the B brand.

35:09.996 --> 35:11.198
[SPEAKER_01]: Could that be part of it?

35:11.903 --> 35:30.385
[SPEAKER_01]: That even though we think that Roman impunk is a bigger match, and everybody we know thinks that, and that's certainly what WWE is positioning it as, but what if actually the big match to most fans that would want to go would actually be drew and Cody, but you may mean.

35:30.787 --> 35:32.130
[SPEAKER_00]: what drew and we're him.

35:32.971 --> 35:41.087
[SPEAKER_01]: But because, but because WWE is positioning them as secondary, maybe fans are like, well, if they don't think that's important, why should we?

35:41.387 --> 35:52.288
[SPEAKER_01]: But if they actually positioned it as the big match, maybe they would sell more tickets, but then you are also going to piss off talking to get pissed off Roman because it's like, no, we're the top dogs.

35:52.673 --> 36:05.913
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I don't know if there's anything to that, but I just thought, you know, maybe, you know, and if SmackDown is the A brand, then maybe they need to start building their main programs around the SmackDown ones and not the Raw ones.

36:05.993 --> 36:11.080
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, saying that, to me, like I just Roman and Punk is the biggest match.

36:11.160 --> 36:15.086
[SPEAKER_01]: Like to me, like, and maybe, you know, and maybe that's it, like I don't know.

36:15.266 --> 36:19.052
[SPEAKER_00]: But if Roman and Punk is probably the bigger match,

36:21.496 --> 36:37.362
[SPEAKER_00]: Is either of those two guys the biggest star still is Roman still the biggest star or the biggest draw or is that Cody because Cody has been on top now for a little while hard to tell like I mean you look at I was looking at Russell tick numbers and

36:37.561 --> 36:40.687
[SPEAKER_01]: Raw ticket sales are still way up.

36:40.847 --> 36:49.504
[SPEAKER_01]: When you look at their numbers, like they're up over year before, SmackDown on Friday did 9,500 previous time in the building did 15,000.

36:49.664 --> 36:52.670
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was for a raw show.

36:53.351 --> 37:00.565
[SPEAKER_01]: Whereas you look at Raw last night in Cleveland did 13,000.

37:00.967 --> 37:04.051
[SPEAKER_01]: previous show last July, SmackDown, 11,000.

37:04.071 --> 37:09.258
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Roy is still selling more life tickets.

37:10.780 --> 37:12.542
[SPEAKER_01]: Which is weird, because it's still on Monday.

37:13.503 --> 37:14.785
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's the other thing, right?

37:14.965 --> 37:17.729
[SPEAKER_01]: Friday should be a way better night for wrestling.

37:18.049 --> 37:21.994
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, and here's what I'm gonna do some forward thinking here.

37:23.176 --> 37:28.122
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's why I think this year's Russell Mania is maybe even more important than people are realizing.

37:28.962 --> 37:31.146
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what you felt coming out of the row, Rumble.

37:31.767 --> 37:36.375
[SPEAKER_00]: But when I was watching the row, Rumble, it's on in the middle of the day.

37:36.395 --> 37:49.097
[SPEAKER_00]: And as I'm watching, I'm like, you know, we are missing out on kind of the normal way that we usually watch this show, you know, usually, usually four or five o'clock, you're hanging out with a bunch of people.

37:49.533 --> 37:55.883
[SPEAKER_00]: But because of that time we could not, like we could like I think there were a couple people watching with Dave or maybe just it was Jeremy.

37:55.923 --> 37:57.606
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't remember, but I couldn't do it.

37:58.046 --> 38:04.076
[SPEAKER_00]: I know a couple of other friends decided to to, um, you know, to watch in the evening, um, instead.

38:04.116 --> 38:06.580
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I can't and I thought, you know,

38:06.560 --> 38:08.263
[SPEAKER_00]: this is usually a commute.

38:08.283 --> 38:10.847
[SPEAKER_00]: This is their most communal show.

38:10.967 --> 38:14.633
[SPEAKER_00]: I usually have people pinging me left and right who don't watch and who go.

38:15.355 --> 38:17.058
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, is the rock spells show up today?

38:17.258 --> 38:18.901
[SPEAKER_00]: Or, oh, who's going to be number 30?

38:18.981 --> 38:19.662
[SPEAKER_00]: Like do you know?

38:19.702 --> 38:23.068
[SPEAKER_00]: And I heard none of that all day long.

38:23.909 --> 38:28.737
[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing is, because it was in Saudi Arabia, visually,

38:29.138 --> 38:46.742
[SPEAKER_00]: they hit you over the head with that because they had to because of the costumes and the women dressing so you immediately when you see that as the first thing that you see you go oh yeah this is different this year they have this entire year and then they are going to do all of this marketing

38:47.937 --> 38:51.542
[SPEAKER_00]: for 2027, for WrestleMania being in Saudi Arabia.

38:52.082 --> 38:59.532
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you were turned off by royal rumble being in Saudi Arabia, and I'm not saying everybody is, but it's very clear not everybody is.

38:59.892 --> 39:04.478
[SPEAKER_00]: Some people are, I don't think that, yeah, I don't think a lot of people are, but clearly somewhere.

39:05.519 --> 39:09.264
[SPEAKER_00]: If that is, if that is not your thing, and you're like, you know what?

39:09.484 --> 39:14.130
[SPEAKER_00]: This is still Ikki to me, thus it's less important to my life.

39:15.190 --> 39:18.274
[SPEAKER_00]: we're gonna have four months of build for this show next year.

39:18.634 --> 39:25.563
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're gonna have a third of the year if you are that person of the Ick when it comes to that kind of thing.

39:25.583 --> 39:32.853
[SPEAKER_00]: So the marketing in of itself and the promotion in of itself may be perceived as negative to people.

39:33.093 --> 39:38.941
[SPEAKER_00]: So they're gonna get the money for it that offsets whatever that is.

39:39.581 --> 39:43.206
[SPEAKER_00]: But then post WrestleMania next year.

39:43.709 --> 40:03.068
[SPEAKER_00]: what is it going to be like unless you know you may get the who knows the rock stone cold all those guys might be on it so it may not be as as bad of a fallout as as I feel that it could be because they may just juice the show like crazy yeah but but even if they do like yeah you put rock you put stone cold on there you undertake or whatever

40:03.048 --> 40:04.810
[SPEAKER_01]: But they're going to be gone the next day.

40:04.871 --> 40:05.592
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

40:05.812 --> 40:19.831
[SPEAKER_01]: So it'll be back to what it was in like the 2010s when you would every year you would bring Undertaker, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, and then you know, they be gone, you know, for the next nine months, you know, and they'll call me at Roy Rumble time and I'll come back for next year's media.

40:20.172 --> 40:20.732
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, like that.

40:20.752 --> 40:28.363
[SPEAKER_00]: And to me, this is Triple H is true test, which is yeah, yeah, Bron, Oba,

40:28.445 --> 40:41.985
[SPEAKER_00]: So Ruka, all of these young trick, all of these people, Javan, Carmelo, all of these people who they are kind of bringing up all the same time right now by next year's Russell Mania.

40:43.487 --> 40:45.510
[SPEAKER_00]: She was the ultimate warrior last night.

40:45.571 --> 40:47.013
[SPEAKER_00]: Did you see her pounding your chest?

40:47.033 --> 40:47.994
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god.

40:48.014 --> 40:54.604
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, all of these folks by this year, next year, this time.

40:54.685 --> 40:56.468
[SPEAKER_00]: they need to be over a start.

40:56.509 --> 40:56.869
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

40:57.070 --> 40:57.470
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

40:57.490 --> 40:57.651
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

40:57.671 --> 41:08.492
[SPEAKER_00]: That is a hard trick for some, you know, even even as much as I like people dismissed Triple H, I don't like his personal, um, like his personal persona.

41:08.978 --> 41:11.522
[SPEAKER_00]: But he's done a tremendous job to me.

41:11.683 --> 41:15.529
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I think he's done a really excellent job at the post-fin速 man thing.

41:15.850 --> 41:29.192
[SPEAKER_00]: So, but this is maybe his biggest test, which is, okay, now we have to create these folks so that next year this time, we have people who the wrestling fans with the WWE fans accept that stars.

41:29.573 --> 41:31.957
[SPEAKER_00]: That is harder said than done, because we've seen it.

41:31.997 --> 41:33.940
[SPEAKER_00]: We saw how long it took

41:33.920 --> 41:42.857
[SPEAKER_00]: Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns, to be the stars that they are today, it took a long time and a lot of television time for that to happen.

41:43.699 --> 41:53.358
[SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully because they're still hot, we can be a little bit more gradual, but I'm looking at this calendar and I'm like, there's going to be lots of reasons for people to not watch WWE.

41:53.378 --> 41:55.422
[SPEAKER_00]: So you have to get those guys over.

41:55.402 --> 41:56.143
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

41:56.163 --> 41:59.407
[SPEAKER_01]: And so all that said, that's hard enough.

41:59.768 --> 42:02.612
[SPEAKER_01]: But then, you know, and I thought this was where you were going and you didn't even mention it.

42:03.192 --> 42:03.873
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe you're going to.

42:04.614 --> 42:25.122
[SPEAKER_01]: You're also going to have two nights of two days of WrestleMania that happened not in the evening when we're normally watching, but during the day, I can see the Sunday one being, you know, I could see Sunday afternoon is a good good day for a paper view and I could see that one actually more people

42:25.743 --> 42:28.366
[SPEAKER_01]: nobody's going to be watching that live in North America.

42:28.927 --> 42:30.909
[SPEAKER_01]: The annex T show if they do.

42:31.931 --> 42:33.373
[SPEAKER_01]: What's that thing in your 6 a.m.?

42:33.573 --> 42:34.634
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't know.

42:34.654 --> 42:35.035
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.

42:36.456 --> 42:38.158
[SPEAKER_01]: No, he's watching.

42:38.179 --> 42:38.959
[SPEAKER_00]: Or Ricky St.

42:39.040 --> 42:40.722
[SPEAKER_00]: Still in the main event on that.

42:40.742 --> 42:43.065
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Ricky St. Ethan Page, God bless him.

42:44.006 --> 42:49.773
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, Colony or Colony Jordan and Kendall Gray wrestling for the women's title.

42:50.454 --> 42:53.598
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, get up at breakfast, breakfast and Saudi.

42:54.399 --> 42:54.499
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

42:54.519 --> 42:54.619
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.

42:55.612 --> 43:01.602
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so let's let's end it with this, which is these the WrestleMania card so far.

43:01.782 --> 43:08.974
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Dave reported that there could be more changes because of that maybe the heat being on Triple H a little bit.

43:10.036 --> 43:13.401
[SPEAKER_00]: They, you know, they do have some time, but

43:14.225 --> 43:34.849
[SPEAKER_00]: you're talking about possibly creating some new programs like LA night one, um, one of the elimination chamber matches, which these, these triple threat matches to get to the elimination chamber are so cheating because they're all no DQ and then it's just vehicles to bring people in and to cause havoc, which is what happened.

43:34.829 --> 43:40.540
[SPEAKER_00]: L.A. Knight takes a tsunami and then has to sell it for about 20 seconds, so then he's able to hit his finish.

43:40.620 --> 43:42.684
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, why did they haven't hit the tsunami?

43:42.704 --> 43:46.451
[SPEAKER_01]: The stupid thing is the whole match, L.A. Knight had the match one.

43:46.471 --> 43:50.398
[SPEAKER_01]: Then they do 18,000 in your fair and spots, and then L.A. Knight wins anyways.

43:50.418 --> 43:51.440
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, just win this way.

43:51.781 --> 43:54.927
[SPEAKER_01]: He could have just had the match, had him win, and then do your post match.

43:56.349 --> 43:56.590
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

43:56.610 --> 43:58.373
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so,

43:58.927 --> 44:13.185
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I don't know exactly where the the chamber part is going unless it's just Cody flat out wins, which is what we thought, but if you were to make a change, I'm not sure if that would be the change, I still feel like Cody has to win.

44:15.408 --> 44:26.662
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, like, you know, I'm I'm not seeing these really have even announced what the chamber matches for like, okay, the men's matches for our shot at Jews title, right?

44:26.702 --> 44:26.902
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

44:27.343 --> 44:28.444
[SPEAKER_01]: What about the women's match?

44:29.015 --> 44:30.598
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I guess live has to pick, right?

44:31.159 --> 44:35.426
[SPEAKER_01]: So the match is for whatever title live doesn't want to fight.

44:36.968 --> 44:37.068
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

44:37.088 --> 44:37.189
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

44:37.209 --> 44:38.150
[SPEAKER_00]: OK. OK. That's a job.

44:38.491 --> 44:46.003
[SPEAKER_00]: Though I want to give, I don't want to just be, you know, only talk about some of the negative stuff because they do have a lot of work to do.

44:46.584 --> 44:50.010
[SPEAKER_00]: However, I will give them credit.

44:50.294 --> 44:52.256
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe this isn't even giving them credit.

44:52.276 --> 44:53.798
[SPEAKER_00]: This is just giving AJ Lee credit.

44:54.739 --> 44:55.940
[SPEAKER_00]: She was so good last night.

44:56.661 --> 45:03.127
[SPEAKER_00]: And Becky was Becky was so over that Becky was doing her best, Roddy, Piper, and Percy, or whatever she was.

45:03.808 --> 45:06.190
[SPEAKER_01]: Ridiculous scenario and made it work.

45:06.290 --> 45:12.116
[SPEAKER_01]: But when you actually break it down to what actually happened in that thing, that was ridiculous.

45:12.137 --> 45:13.898
[SPEAKER_01]: Like it makes no sense at all.

45:13.918 --> 45:16.521
[SPEAKER_01]: But the performances were so great that you overlook it.

45:16.501 --> 45:19.444
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the what I got out of it is the baby face.

45:19.544 --> 45:29.114
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is what I like about wrestling the baby face in AJ Lee outsmarted the hubris of Becky Lynch at the end of the day she took advantage.

45:29.214 --> 45:45.411
[SPEAKER_00]: She knew exactly the thing that Becky wanted held it out and then got what she wanted to give Becky what she wanted and so what are Becky wanted match Becky wanted the one on one match because she feels that she will kill AJ Lee and AJ Lee was kind of like

45:45.391 --> 45:57.047
[SPEAKER_00]: You might be right, so thus you have to put something on the line so that it's worth it for my time, too, because I just might get my ass kicked and then they put the title on, and that was enough that was enough for AJ league.

45:57.067 --> 46:01.252
[SPEAKER_01]: No, you know, if you want to wrestle me five, but it's not for the title.

46:02.734 --> 46:04.377
[SPEAKER_01]: I would say, but she got out smart.

46:04.437 --> 46:09.964
[SPEAKER_00]: That's that was the beauty of AJ Lee the baby face.

46:09.944 --> 46:13.408
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, I just liked both of their performances so much.

46:13.448 --> 46:15.951
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't really care that what I was watching did make sense.

46:16.371 --> 46:17.713
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I looked at it.

46:18.174 --> 46:21.858
[SPEAKER_01]: So to me, it's like, I'd rather see good performances than anything else.

46:21.938 --> 46:22.919
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what I saw last night.

46:22.939 --> 46:26.483
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the punk, the punk, the ball, the baller thing was very similar in a way.

46:27.064 --> 46:30.408
[SPEAKER_01]: Like it's like very last minute, very rushed.

46:30.608 --> 46:32.290
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, there's no bills to this.

46:32.270 --> 46:38.822
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't like it when somebody who's supposed to be going for something gets buried on the way to going to that thing.

46:39.103 --> 46:47.198
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm like, why do we care if you're promoting this thing and then you're telling us that this guy doesn't deserve it, like why am I supposed to care exactly.

46:47.298 --> 46:50.323
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so like at least make try to make us believe.

46:51.025 --> 46:56.134
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, you know what if if punk wins, we have a new main event at wrestling, maybe that's the change.

46:57.987 --> 46:59.529
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what should happen, right?

47:00.110 --> 47:05.136
[SPEAKER_00]: As they're promoting punk versus Roman, there should be the caveat.

47:05.496 --> 47:06.938
[SPEAKER_00]: It's possible that it's Finn Malar, right?

47:07.539 --> 47:10.903
[SPEAKER_00]: Because if you don't do that, then you're just telegrafing it.

47:11.003 --> 47:13.626
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's already telegraft as it is.

47:13.646 --> 47:18.652
[SPEAKER_01]: Or you set up something else for Finn where Finn wins, he's got a big match.

47:18.833 --> 47:20.495
[SPEAKER_01]: We're still gonna get Roman and punk.

47:20.655 --> 47:22.918
[SPEAKER_00]: Or that's where the chamber part comes in.

47:23.078 --> 47:26.442
[SPEAKER_00]: If Finn wins, the chamber winner,

47:26.422 --> 47:49.273
[SPEAKER_00]: made decide that they want Finn instead of Drew right and then yeah and we're still getting Roman and punk no matter what yeah, which is that fucking Adam Pierce should have said last night instead of going crazy and not wanting that match to happen like you could still have the match dude and you could even go to Rome and then and say listen like if this match happens like

47:49.253 --> 47:54.421
[SPEAKER_01]: Roman you're still going to fight punk at WrestleMania and Roman can be like, yeah, I want punk.

47:54.521 --> 47:56.124
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even care if the title's on the line.

47:56.144 --> 47:57.285
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to get my hands on that guy.

47:58.067 --> 48:01.632
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you have a match that doesn't even need the title.

48:01.893 --> 48:07.441
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it probably will still have it, but punk wants Roman so bad that he doesn't even care for the title.

48:07.461 --> 48:11.768
[SPEAKER_01]: Then now, if I said, we care about the match itself, not so much the title.

48:11.748 --> 48:37.603
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is, if it's for the title, like I don't even know fans want Roman to win because you know what I mean like oh does that mean we get three title matches in the next year and if we go back to what we think is working with AEW it is the fact that there is more than one person who the fans want to see face the champion that if we believe that is what's working yeah and WWE is kind of doing it in the opposite way a little bit.

48:37.887 --> 48:46.159
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, like it's almost like there's one match that matters and it's WrestleMania everything else doesn't matter at all like really is what they're telling us.

48:47.017 --> 48:49.519
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, you and Jeff will be back after this.

48:49.599 --> 48:50.180
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this?

48:50.240 --> 48:53.803
[SPEAKER_00]: Dynamites in California, before they head out on the area?

48:54.264 --> 48:56.025
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they're just in Ontario for the weekend.

48:56.086 --> 49:04.093
[SPEAKER_01]: So they'll be back in next week, I think, in, I can remember where they are at West Coast somewhere, but they're back in the same place.

49:04.113 --> 49:10.799
[SPEAKER_00]: So they're in California, and then they fly to Australia, and then they fly back to somewhere.

49:11.160 --> 49:15.724
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the 18th is, it's some, is that the San Jose

49:17.223 --> 49:19.767
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, and I don't think so.

49:20.128 --> 49:25.877
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that A, W in San Jose is in, um, April, I think.

49:26.618 --> 49:26.898
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

49:27.059 --> 49:27.659
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

49:27.679 --> 49:29.262
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, March, March 11th.

49:29.663 --> 49:30.764
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have a month.

49:31.666 --> 49:31.926
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

49:31.946 --> 49:35.512
[SPEAKER_01]: There, uh, February 18th, they are in Sacramento.

49:36.293 --> 49:36.573
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

49:36.814 --> 49:37.074
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

49:37.194 --> 49:41.061
[SPEAKER_00]: So they're back to the West Coast to Australia, back to the West Coast.

49:41.081 --> 49:41.682
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

49:41.702 --> 49:42.623
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's try me that song.

49:42.940 --> 49:53.489
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it could be worse, but yeah, they're basically on the west coast now, Western time zones, anyways, all until St. Paul went a pick in early April.

49:53.869 --> 49:54.730
[SPEAKER_00]: Should be at that.

49:55.171 --> 49:56.211
[SPEAKER_00]: Sounds a civic show.

49:56.952 --> 50:00.595
[SPEAKER_00]: And then WWE comes here for Smackdown in April.

50:00.775 --> 50:03.438
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll have back to back months of wrestling.

50:03.498 --> 50:07.321
[SPEAKER_01]: And I, you know, maybe get a hold of my contacts over to AWS.

50:07.341 --> 50:09.903
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I can get those sweet collision seats for their dime.

50:09.923 --> 50:10.724
[SPEAKER_01]: That would be cool.

50:10.824 --> 50:11.985
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the only way I'm going.

50:11.965 --> 50:12.326
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

50:12.908 --> 50:13.209
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

50:13.792 --> 50:14.173
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

50:14.374 --> 50:15.076
[SPEAKER_00]: That is it from here.

50:15.277 --> 50:16.782
[SPEAKER_00]: So for Paul, I am WG.

50:17.023 --> 50:19.191
[SPEAKER_00]: We will see when we see you piece out.