WWE & UFC: TKO Stays In Business With ESPN & Joins The Paramount Family | AEW Forbidden Door & WWE Possibly Counterprogramming AEW All Out With Lesnar Vs Cena | Takedown

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[SPEAKER_01]: All right, all the perfect story drop today for us, the UFC rights with paramount plus paramount plus just came out of the blue to win this deal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: At least as far as the reporting that I saw was concerned though yesterday, Lucas Shaw from Bloomberg.

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[SPEAKER_01]: added Paramount to the list of folks who UFC was having discussions with, and it was the first time I'd seen their name.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He also included YouTube in that as well, which I hadn't seen really seen YouTube before, but Paramount Plus, they got the deal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They and the UFC came to a seven year, seven point seven billion dollar agreement, which begins January, twenty, twenty, six, so right around the corner.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We'll get thirteen previous paper views that they're calling them the number of events and thirty fight nights that will be on paramount plus with it sounds like according to Dana White.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Four of those numbered events also being simulcast on CBS proper.

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[SPEAKER_01]: How does that work for you guys by the way?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll get the CBS for sure, because CBS is carried on all the major cable companies, and you can even get it with rabbit ears, I think, if anybody still uses that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But the, as far as Paramount Plus, I have no idea, but I do know that, and people have been asking Aaron Braun, said it all day, and he works for SportsNet, who is the UFC paperview carrier in Canada, and he has not answered anybody.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So obviously he doesn't know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But I don't care if the plus is actively looking for the global rights as well.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It looks like they will get the first opportunity for any deal that comes up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So kind of like WWE with Netflix, I guess.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The the only thing like I can say that our our paramount we do have paramount plus.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But it is different than the US one.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And every time, like for instance, a Bellator ran on Paramount Plus for a while.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, nobody watched it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know if they were even getting any money for it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But we didn't get it up here.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And there's a few other sports that they've carried over the years.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And we never, there's never been sports.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There isn't even a section on the Paramount Plus app.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I looked again today to make sure there isn't even a sports section on there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's all just, I mean, they have all the shows, the TV shows.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They do have special events.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like stuff like the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it's weird, like it's, and they have the news.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And even CBS news is on there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But so I don't know it, but I would imagine there's going to be a lot of people getting VPNs.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This is the case because I

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[SPEAKER_00]: Put it this way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you, if you have sees going to be free in the States, I am not paying seventy dollars and that's what we pay up here.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The little cheaper.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'll just not watch the shows.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm not paying for shows that are free in the States.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No way.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the Dave Meltzer wrote something, I think that is for the actual observed that comes out on Friday, but it's free to subscribers on the website right now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And he did the math and said something to the effect of, you know, they probably need to do seven million subscribers, extra subscribers to to match the deal and, you know, each year, whatever, well, I forget whatever the math was.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And Dave likes to do the conversion of like

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, straight conversion.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This is the amount of money.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The membership is and here's the amount of money in this.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Here's how you get to that money.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I know he does it that way because it is it is easy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It is easy math to get people to see.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What is the value to paramount?

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[SPEAKER_01]: What would you have see the value of you have see?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Here's what they think it will be.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It means seven million extra subscribers.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now, it doesn't always work that way, because in some cases you have ads, in some cases, especially with Netflix, there's an engagement side where it is valuable to Netflix if this show

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[SPEAKER_01]: Then converts to someone watching this show that converts to someone watching this show and that's they they call that stat engagement Some of these other platforms though they don't have great engagement because their algorithms aren't fantastic in the way that their built doesn't work like Netflix, but there's two things and here's my big take on on this deal

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they're relying on seven million new subscribers, by the way.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What I think they're relying on is on two different things.

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[SPEAKER_01]: One.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They're going to go hardcore, password sharing lockdown.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This is how Netflix grew big time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Over the last two years, I think they're pretty much at the end of it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they have gone through the accounts anymore.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think they're pretty much done with that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Disney Plus, I think did some of that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: HBO Max did some of that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That's how you

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[SPEAKER_01]: grow your subscriber base.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, okay, we know that there are four people using this, this particular password.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Instead, here's, you know, here's a seven, ninety nine subscription.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Do you want to use that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's how they kind of artificially, you know,

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[SPEAKER_01]: And artificially to us, but to them, they're like, this is, you know, one subscriber per household or whatever whatever it is.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think there's some work there to do and how many subscribers they can get out of that work.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to be a nice amount for sure, but other than that, I think there's going to be a price hike coming.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, I don't know what it's like in the States, but I do know that for Paramount Plus here in Canada, if I'm watching something on it and my wife tries to watch something on it upstairs, she can't.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So they only allow one user and we have, I mean, there's only one tier that you can buy.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So maybe they'll add to yours too.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's going to be ways they can finagle it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know exactly how works.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't tested it to see.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And the other, yeah, that's for the, like I did some math and I mean, a two dollar price increase would more than cover what they're paying you see.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I think you're going to increase it a lot more than two dollars.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the interesting thing about this deal is for the beginning of the deal, the money is a little bit less than that average.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And for the near the end of the deal, the money is more than what that one point one, I think.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, most deals are like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Because they keep hitting this twelve ninety-nine deal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That's like they're marketing for this as they're having their Mark Shapiro and people like that talk about it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And so let's say you can stay at twelve ninety-nine for a little while.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Because your payment to UFC is a little bit lesser, especially in that first year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And maybe you can use that as your hardcore marketing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You can watch the UFC for just twelve ninety nine a month.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then two years into that deal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Then you go, okay, we're going up by three bucks and then the next year you go up by another three bucks.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think the price point that they want to get to is twenty.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's just me sort of reading the T-Leaves of these other companies.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So two products that are about to come out in very soon.

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[SPEAKER_01]: One of them is ESPN's app.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now they are at twenty nine ninety nine.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_01]: A lesser promoted app that is coming out is Fox one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Fox one their app is nineteen ninety nine.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So what do you get by watching Fox content I mean you get the you get football which is why they're coming out now because you get all you would get all the football if you're not in cable and you want to and you want to watch.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, football.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You would get all that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You would get some baseball world series stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, get some code sent say they're good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You get to Wayne's league.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You get to your fellow, but you also get, um, college football.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, big, it's big for that stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, I'm sure you're going to get all the archives.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think they have college basketball too, which is big.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They have some college basketball.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So

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[SPEAKER_01]: That is already twenty and that is their early entry price points.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You have ESPN and Fox one going early entry at such a high price point, which probably is going to hurt their growth right away.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So if you're a paramount, you can go look at these guys.

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[SPEAKER_01]: look at how much more expensive they are than us were the better bargain and here's what you get with our thing so but I do think that by those apps having those price points you you're looking at paramount going like okay we can if we can get to that and we can have very little churn and we can still grow were were in business man and and that's I think where they get to

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[SPEAKER_00]: The the other thing that like so the thing about that and I think we had a little bit of discussion about this today in the discord.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if part of that strategy of having that high price point is actually.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like a mental thing to try and actually convince people to either stay with cable or go back to cable because my understanding is that if you have ESPN on your cable system, you get that ESPN app and you don't have to pay the thirty bucks.

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[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of the cable companies are offering it, but not all of them are.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, but for the ones that are and and and certainly and again, it's going to vary depending on where you are and what cable company use and what what other options are but for instance here again, you know, it's a little different, but what I did the math it worked out that I could get everything I was paying for all a cart.

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[SPEAKER_00]: on my cable bundle because finally after years and years and years of losing customers just drizzling away the cable companies finally start to figure out wait a minute if we want to keep these people we have to change the way we do things and they realize that sports was the main driver so they started offering these packages that included the sports networks and they included it for less than what you would pay

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[SPEAKER_00]: for just getting the sports network.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it's most people don't even realize it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And for me, like I switch back to cable, I saved money.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now again, there's there's some reasons that people like streaming and you know, you explained it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just like I like it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the freedom and for absolute apps.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, and you're allowed in all that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, yeah, the way that my cable, I actually know I haven't tried Comcast here where I currently live, but when I was in Gilroy and I had the charter, it was like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: twenty years like archaic like Jurassic Park era cable and I was like I can't deal with this especially if you are a direct TV person which kind of gets you almost to the modern times and then to go back to cable and I was like oh my gosh this is like twenty years ago yeah we're like we're I would call it what I have is almost like a hybrid because everything that I have on cable also I have on streaming so you know like I can do just do streaming if I wanted to

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I like to have in the PVR and we don't unfortunately have the cloud PVR as of yet a little insurance coming in twenty years.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, so it's interesting and I did some some other math too and like with this one point one billion dollars like

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's almost double what they're getting now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think Dave had that in his article as well, which means that it's the equivalent.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's hard to break it down between the TV shows and that, but it actually works out to about twenty five million dollars per show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: and so right now they're getting about thirteen million dollars per show and that includes the fight nights so i mean you know and those shows you know like they're just profit like the fighters on those fight night shows like we've run and i did the math when we had our podcast going and i mean it was rare that all the fighters on a show would make a million dollars combined

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[SPEAKER_00]: And and they're making thirteen million just for their media rights for that plus ticket sales plus merchandise plus sponsorship like it's it's ridiculous, but they're again, they're going to be getting the equivalent for the paper views shows of approximately six hundred thousand buys a show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And there's no way they're, they would be doing six hundred thousand buys on paper for you.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So this is, I mean, so then how it's for you, how does paramount maximize the value from that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Some of it is going to be because they're going to be, they're going to be able to sell.

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[SPEAKER_01]: ads on some of the bigger paper views.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, they're hoping for the growth in the, but they're also going to be looking at the people that get the paramount app that don't watch you see that get it for like big brother, Yellowstone, Star Trek, you know, all the popular stuff there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to get they're going to be subsidizing UFC for a while.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And the other thing is is if you are a UFC fan, who is also a seasonal Taylor shared in fan,

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[SPEAKER_01]: You probably not canceling.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's that's also the big thing is that monthly stuff helps with the churn.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, that's a big that's that's a great point and one that needs to be considered for something like this because UFC is every week pretty much.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they do they do take the odd week off, but

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[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so let's talk about the WWE deal that just came out at the end of last week.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the WWE deal with ESPN.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's obviously a little bit less than this one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: A lot less than this one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: One point six billion over five years and you have to use the ESPN app to watch this content.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Now there's been discussions about them showing some stuff on on ESPN proper.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not like the way that Dave explained it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but you know doing it is like showing the first hour of WrestleMania on ESPN and then you got to dump over to the app.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's the same customer, so I don't know how that helps with growth, but

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[SPEAKER_01]: The idea of having this app, which is going to be thirty bucks, unless you have a subscription to ESPN on cable for I think they're going to try and get to all hundred percent of those folks, but it's not like that yet.

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[SPEAKER_01]: WWE and ESPN, I think this is a very interesting

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[SPEAKER_01]: relationship.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The E in ESPN does stand for entertainment like that they lead with the E in their their brand name and WWE is entertainment.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it seems like a natural fit.

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[SPEAKER_01]: WWE will get more coverage just being an ESPN partner.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They'll get more people on these goofy shows that people watch that I never watch, but they're very popular.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think just for a brand thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's almost like being on ESPN solidifies something.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What that thing is and how ESPN will deal with some of the fallout of some of the things that that they do will be interesting.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't imagine they're going to be too cut throat with WWE because ESPN has their own problems, but you know, if a talent says something that gets up to that level, do they, you know,

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[SPEAKER_01]: have a conversation with somebody yet, you know, with Nick Khan and go, hey, man, like this person needs to apologize.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like stuff like that, that is unsorted out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and then because the relationship has name started yet, and it won't until Russell, many of next year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So what do you think about WWE and ESPN?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's interesting because at the same time the WWE is moving to ESPN, UFC is moving away from ESPN.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that one of the things, I won't say it's under-apported, but one of the things that a lot of people don't think about is the rise in popularity of UFC over the last five to ten years.

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[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of that has had to do with being on ESPN.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And the fact that their shows are promoted on those shows you talk about, they're promoted on sports center.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They have UFC fighters all over there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Their UFC, or ESPN is a destination program for our destination network for sports fans.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's the first place you go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So when you, when you tune to ESPN, you would see UFC content, you know, if you stayed there long enough, well, now that's going to be WWE that you're going to see.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So number one, it may hurt UFC.

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[SPEAKER_00]: to be moving to a network that's not traditionally doesn't have a lot of sports.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I know Paramount Plus has some.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm in the NFL's the biggest one, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Are they on Paramount Plus?

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[SPEAKER_01]: They are on Paramount Plus.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You can actually, I actually watch on Paramount Plus.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think there is a live

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[SPEAKER_01]: channel aspect to paramount.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So it's basically whatever the main CBS game is for that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

17:34.118 --> 17:34.358
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

17:34.398 --> 17:35.519
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, there you go.

17:35.539 --> 17:35.619
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

17:35.719 --> 17:37.380
[SPEAKER_00]: So so sports fans are used to going there.

17:37.400 --> 17:46.767
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's not going to hurt as much as I thought, but they don't and maybe they don't have a, you know, like a sports center kind of thing, but you know, maybe they'll develop that now now that they're getting more into live sports.

17:47.267 --> 17:50.149
[SPEAKER_00]: But in terms of WWE, I mean, that's already established.

17:50.229 --> 17:53.712
[SPEAKER_00]: And sports center isn't what it was when we were, you know, in our twenties.

17:54.152 --> 18:04.540
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's still something, you know, and then all these, you know, like the Pat McAfee show and you Steven A Smith and all that stuff, you know, PTI, I think is still going.

18:04.920 --> 18:09.063
[SPEAKER_00]: So they'll have more WWE stuff on there by default.

18:09.223 --> 18:11.685
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're going to have WWE wrestlers, guessing.

18:12.045 --> 18:17.849
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll probably have them on the, they still have the NFL pre game shows on ESPN.

18:18.169 --> 18:21.511
[SPEAKER_00]: So they'll be doing cross branding and all that stuff.

18:22.372 --> 18:24.793
[SPEAKER_00]: And that'll help them out a lot.

18:25.594 --> 18:32.278
[SPEAKER_00]: And the money, like you said, it's quite a bit less, but it's not as much less as it seems like because you got to remember.

18:32.858 --> 18:35.519
[SPEAKER_00]: This is only for twelve events a year.

18:36.160 --> 18:39.962
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the UFC was for almost four times as much content.

18:40.182 --> 18:46.085
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but what's the weight in those thirteen events for UFC versus the?

18:46.205 --> 18:50.367
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, because here's the problem with that deal to kind of what you're saying.

18:51.188 --> 18:56.331
[SPEAKER_01]: Paramount plus's viewership is going to be so much less than ESPN.

18:56.791 --> 18:57.011
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

18:57.031 --> 19:02.374
[SPEAKER_01]: Those forty shows, those fight night shows, it's going to be minuscule viewership.

19:03.555 --> 19:09.119
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's already like the fight past shows don't even trend on Google.

19:09.959 --> 19:13.422
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that Paramount Plus shows will be even less than that.

19:14.302 --> 19:15.143
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is a history.

19:15.183 --> 19:17.444
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like I said, we had Bellator on there already.

19:18.165 --> 19:20.226
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, they never registered.

19:20.386 --> 19:22.228
[SPEAKER_00]: Like nobody ever talked about those shows.

19:23.069 --> 19:27.676
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, and eventually they'd just stop doing it because I don't think anybody even noticed that.

19:27.776 --> 19:35.728
[SPEAKER_01]: I think if you add up the PLEs plus raw plus SmackDown, I think you get to that one point one billion or close.

19:37.057 --> 19:38.258
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh yeah, yeah, that's what I mean.

19:38.418 --> 19:54.143
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, so the money is actually like I did math again, and I might be off here because this sounds really high, but the three hundred and twenty five million for twelve events works out to about twenty we're such about twenty seven million per show.

19:54.883 --> 20:04.896
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you go with the idea that WWE's cut on paper view is, like, thirty bucks, if the paper view was sixty, that's at nine hundred thousand buys a show.

20:04.916 --> 20:10.943
[SPEAKER_00]: They're getting the equivalent of, like, there's no way anything but WrestleMania would even come close to nine hundred thousand.

20:10.963 --> 20:11.804
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't even think it would.

20:13.065 --> 20:15.347
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like that's that money's insane.

20:16.047 --> 20:17.749
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's only for the PLEs.

20:17.809 --> 20:20.570
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it's not there's no archive component.

20:20.610 --> 20:21.951
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no live weekly shows.

20:21.991 --> 20:26.274
[SPEAKER_00]: Like this was an amazing deal for for WWE.

20:26.654 --> 20:33.059
[SPEAKER_00]: But as we saw with UFC, when that thing was signed, you know, five years ago, I think it was at the time.

20:33.079 --> 20:34.740
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember Dave saying it.

20:34.760 --> 20:35.760
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think I was right with him.

20:35.800 --> 20:37.422
[SPEAKER_00]: Like this doesn't make any sense.

20:38.282 --> 20:43.104
[SPEAKER_00]: And by the end of it, you'll see with, or ESPN, like it was a great deal for ESPN.

20:43.124 --> 20:43.244
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

20:43.644 --> 20:43.804
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

20:44.044 --> 20:46.745
[SPEAKER_00]: So I, that could end up being the case here.

20:47.106 --> 20:54.549
[SPEAKER_00]: If all of a sudden WWE's audience doubles, because of all the exposure they're getting on ESPN, this deal might look cheap in five years.

20:55.129 --> 20:57.830
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a, I have a take on the timing of everything.

20:58.650 --> 21:07.514
[SPEAKER_01]: There's, there's a little bit of like kind of wondering speculation here on my end, but if you're TKO,

21:08.700 --> 21:10.741
[SPEAKER_01]: He have both rights coming up at the same time.

21:11.882 --> 21:21.008
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know the market, you're working with the SPN with the TKO deal.

21:21.688 --> 21:22.989
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, with the UFC deal.

21:23.790 --> 21:28.873
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you kind of know what their feeling is around spending that much money to keep everything.

21:29.709 --> 21:45.695
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you go, okay, well, here's a great plan B. We have these PLEs that, and so, you know, you can imagine that if ESPN likes the business of TKO, they don't want the A product.

21:46.235 --> 21:48.636
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, here's the B product and you save money.

21:48.656 --> 21:52.778
[SPEAKER_01]: ESPN opted out of the baseball rights.

21:53.871 --> 21:55.913
[SPEAKER_01]: They, they said no to F one.

21:56.593 --> 22:10.745
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're not to say that they're saying a saving money thing, but they are not looking to, you know, after doing the NFL deal and the basketball dealer, they're not, they're not just looking to spend money like crazy like they spent their money.

22:10.805 --> 22:12.227
[SPEAKER_01]: So now they're looking for value.

22:13.273 --> 22:14.094
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you're T.K.L.

22:14.114 --> 22:21.459
[SPEAKER_01]: you're like, you know, your March period, like, hey, you know, it doesn't look like this deal with the UFC for the UFC rights is going the way that we want.

22:21.819 --> 22:25.281
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, we have this other company that is going to pay us more.

22:25.401 --> 22:26.782
[SPEAKER_01]: So great.

22:26.962 --> 22:35.688
[SPEAKER_01]: But here's here's the PLEs and I wonder how much of plan A plan B they actually worked with ESPN on when it came to that.

22:36.549 --> 22:39.551
[SPEAKER_00]: Somebody on the FW board pointed out that

22:40.276 --> 22:53.397
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that the deal that ESPN walked away from was five hundred fifty million for the at Major League Baseball and now they're bidding on a secondary package that is looking to probably go for around two hundred million.

22:54.182 --> 22:56.824
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the difference between those two is what they paid for WWE.

22:57.144 --> 22:57.364
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

22:57.524 --> 22:57.885
[SPEAKER_00]: Smart.

22:57.925 --> 22:58.926
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah.

22:58.966 --> 22:59.226
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

22:59.786 --> 23:00.026
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

23:00.106 --> 23:01.908
[SPEAKER_01]: So I began WWE.

23:02.388 --> 23:05.030
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we'll help with that churn for that app as well.

23:05.070 --> 23:07.011
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're WWE canceling.

23:07.112 --> 23:11.255
[SPEAKER_00]: So and WWE fans have shown that they'll stick with whatever format.

23:11.695 --> 23:13.756
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, like every time they switch,

23:14.637 --> 23:17.179
[SPEAKER_00]: It ends up being cheaper for WFN.

23:17.479 --> 23:21.341
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember being so happy when the network started about how much money I was going to save and I did.

23:21.361 --> 23:25.944
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure it's cheaper necessarily than the WV network was though.

23:26.184 --> 23:27.825
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's cheaper if you already have a SPN.

23:27.885 --> 23:42.233
[SPEAKER_00]: If you already are paying the SPN and if you're already and even if you're not like if you look at what that app is going to be offering and then you kind of factor in OK, well, how much of this and my dedicated to WWE, it might be less than ten dollars a month.

23:43.011 --> 23:44.812
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you get NFL and everything else.

23:45.373 --> 23:48.655
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, last one, you wanted to talk a little bit about forbidden door.

23:48.716 --> 23:49.936
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't want the collision.

23:49.957 --> 23:52.679
[SPEAKER_01]: I heard the results.

23:52.939 --> 23:54.740
[SPEAKER_01]: I heard Brian and Dave talk about collision.

23:54.860 --> 23:56.742
[SPEAKER_01]: So what is your take on that forbidden door?

23:56.942 --> 24:01.365
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, overall, I would just say that I've just not really feeling it.

24:01.586 --> 24:06.169
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, some of that is obviously New Japan is part of this and they got the G one going on.

24:06.209 --> 24:09.212
[SPEAKER_00]: So they can't really commit to anything until that tournament's over.

24:09.292 --> 24:09.452
[SPEAKER_00]: But

24:10.012 --> 24:18.255
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, like we're gonna have like, it looks like it's gonna be MJF and Hangman, which there's no way Hangman's losing the title on his first go round.

24:18.935 --> 24:25.338
[SPEAKER_00]: We've got Tony and Athena and I don't think anybody expects Tony to lose the title right now.

24:26.158 --> 24:36.662
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, we gotta, you know, probably a bunch of A, W and New Japan matches and one of which is Kyle Fletcher against a mystery opponent that, you know, is really starting to look like it's gonna be Hiroshi Tanahashi.

24:37.862 --> 24:42.424
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, to me, like the last time I saw Hiroshi Tanahashi on an EW show, it wasn't pretty.

24:43.665 --> 24:56.290
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it was against MJF and, you know, the problem is is when he's when he's in Japan and he's not having to like do these flights and he's just kind of, you know, riding the bus with everybody or wherever he's getting from show to show.

24:57.210 --> 25:11.198
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like he's in decent enough shape to work good matches, but if he has to do a transatlantic flight and show up, you know, like, and get off the plane and be wrestling twelve hours later, like, with that broken down body, it's, it's not easy.

25:11.318 --> 25:12.919
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm a little worried about that.

25:12.939 --> 25:20.803
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just like, overall, like, I'm just wondering how much buzz there is for this show, you know, and especially WWE kind of sucked

25:21.652 --> 25:25.635
[SPEAKER_00]: all the air out of the room was summer slam, you know, between Brock and the cash in.

25:25.695 --> 25:32.561
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, I mean, basically that, you know, and then whatever happened this week, which I still haven't seen.

25:33.782 --> 25:38.846
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's like, you know, it feels like WWE had all that momentum coming out of all in.

25:39.207 --> 25:41.949
[SPEAKER_00]: And as we speculated, like always have weekly, right?

25:42.089 --> 25:43.751
[SPEAKER_00]: A week later, it was like it didn't even happen.

25:43.851 --> 25:46.793
[SPEAKER_01]: What will have about the, I'm with you on forbidden door.

25:46.873 --> 25:48.074
[SPEAKER_01]: Like forbidden door is going to be fine.

25:48.134 --> 25:49.916
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be a good lesson show, but from the

25:50.556 --> 25:54.458
[SPEAKER_01]: Marky standpoint of like is this a giant event?

25:55.759 --> 26:00.081
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't I don't think it feels like a giant event, but I think it'd be a really fun live event.

26:00.422 --> 26:03.583
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like in London, like, you know, that's gonna be great.

26:03.623 --> 26:04.864
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the crowds gonna be nuts.

26:05.765 --> 26:06.965
[SPEAKER_00]: I know people that are going to it.

26:07.245 --> 26:09.667
[SPEAKER_01]: So you heard the rumors that

26:10.587 --> 26:15.289
[SPEAKER_01]: WWE's gonna run a show in September that possibly may go up against all out.

26:15.850 --> 26:16.750
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it's a rumor.

26:16.770 --> 26:20.232
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's happening, but they haven't announced the event.

26:20.252 --> 26:20.772
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.

26:21.232 --> 26:21.513
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

26:21.593 --> 26:23.373
[SPEAKER_01]: No, as far as I know they haven't announced the event.

26:23.434 --> 26:25.434
[SPEAKER_00]: And that, I mean, would likely be Brock.

26:25.475 --> 26:26.115
[SPEAKER_00]: I would assume.

26:26.155 --> 26:26.955
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I think it's Brock.

26:26.975 --> 26:29.937
[SPEAKER_00]: See, you know, I think that's the match that they're gonna run.

26:30.737 --> 26:34.220
[SPEAKER_00]: That is, I mean, this is what you talked about leading into all in.

26:34.620 --> 26:38.603
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, if they're going to have competition, they got to be serious about it.

26:38.903 --> 26:41.265
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, garbage in XT at them.

26:41.565 --> 26:49.471
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Saturday night's main event was an interesting one because of the idea that people would watch it on NBC.

26:50.072 --> 26:51.032
[SPEAKER_01]: It forced them to move.

26:52.633 --> 26:54.435
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what Browniel will move this one.

26:55.467 --> 27:09.237
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it'll be, if that's the positioning and the game'smanship that is gonna happen because, you know, Gunther and Bill Goldberg, to a certain audience, I'm sure that was a giant match.

27:09.397 --> 27:19.224
[SPEAKER_01]: In the current ecosystem of WWE, I did not feel like it was that big of a match, but if you're running Brock and John Cena,

27:20.383 --> 27:28.086
[SPEAKER_01]: That is about as big of a non-title, non-caching, non-special match that that you can get.

27:28.106 --> 27:33.467
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's something that you've set up and that they're just waiting for.

27:33.487 --> 27:37.609
[SPEAKER_01]: Take away the B from Brock, and that's the only other match that's the only other one.

27:37.909 --> 27:43.811
[SPEAKER_01]: And look, to me, I don't need to see these dudes wrestle ever again, because we've seen it a bunch of times.

27:43.851 --> 27:47.392
[SPEAKER_01]: And neither guy is going to be at the top of their game, and they're going to do some sort of

27:47.952 --> 27:51.594
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they're going to do some smoke and mirrors thing to make it entertaining.

27:51.995 --> 27:55.457
[SPEAKER_01]: But again, it's going to be more about what happens at the end of that match.

27:55.497 --> 27:57.198
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the moment coming out of that match?

27:57.218 --> 28:03.382
[SPEAKER_01]: Because that's how they book these days that how they're going to try and steal the headlines from all out, right?

28:03.402 --> 28:15.791
[SPEAKER_01]: Whatever happens at all out, whether it's Christian and Edge or whatever the title matches, WWE's going to just try and take all of the attention away based on what happens at the result of that rock lesser in John Cena match.

28:16.464 --> 28:25.473
[SPEAKER_00]: It'll be interesting because if it doesn't work, then that's a big L for a WWE.

28:25.553 --> 28:31.899
[SPEAKER_00]: And whereas at the AWS, you kind of can go into that and say, hey, we're just going to put on our show and what we do is what we do.

28:32.300 --> 28:35.403
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously put on a great show and see how they do.

28:35.423 --> 28:37.645
[SPEAKER_00]: I think AWS has nothing to lose there.

28:38.253 --> 28:38.754
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?

28:38.774 --> 28:45.003
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if they do a hundred and ten thousand buys for a show that should have done on the court isn't a heavy buy show for them.

28:45.063 --> 28:54.757
[SPEAKER_00]: Now now although in this this case they're going a month later and usually it's like two weeks later in one case it was even one week later I think so I mean the only thing I think

28:55.397 --> 28:57.539
[SPEAKER_01]: That would matter is a for whatever reason.

28:57.599 --> 29:12.668
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like they do seventy five thousand buys which they're not they have they you know if they have a minimum audience right now, but even if they do even if they do yeah, it's it's a it's an ego It's an ego problem, but how much money is that cost it?

29:12.708 --> 29:14.129
[SPEAKER_00]: It's cost them like three million dollars.

29:14.530 --> 29:16.171
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, that's nothing

29:16.791 --> 29:17.431
[SPEAKER_00]: It's nothing.

29:17.491 --> 29:18.672
[SPEAKER_00]: They could just zero by it.

29:18.712 --> 29:20.332
[SPEAKER_01]: It would hurt some feelings, though.

29:20.612 --> 29:21.073
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

29:21.153 --> 29:21.373
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

29:21.633 --> 29:22.513
[SPEAKER_00]: It would be an ego.

29:22.813 --> 29:25.754
[SPEAKER_00]: It would be a hit to the ego, but in terms of like the bottom line now.

29:26.154 --> 29:28.195
[SPEAKER_00]: And then Tony, you know, can look at it.

29:28.215 --> 29:30.536
[SPEAKER_00]: Stay through the best match they possibly could at us.

29:31.116 --> 29:32.657
[SPEAKER_00]: And we still did seventy five thousand buys.

29:33.417 --> 29:34.317
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know what I mean?

29:34.357 --> 29:41.700
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that that's, that's what, you know, that's why I say it's no lose for a W and they should just go ahead and put on their best show.

29:42.140 --> 29:42.680
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that they can.

29:43.121 --> 29:44.261
[SPEAKER_00]: And whatever happens happens.

29:45.219 --> 29:49.501
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, we're able to get to four nice little topics there in a half an hour.

29:49.601 --> 29:50.261
[SPEAKER_01]: So I like that.

29:50.581 --> 29:54.323
[SPEAKER_00]: And we got a lot of discussion about our show last week.

29:54.343 --> 29:54.963
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was happy.

29:54.983 --> 29:55.884
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was cool.

29:56.004 --> 29:56.684
[SPEAKER_01]: That was really cool.

29:56.864 --> 30:01.766
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's kind of because it is very topic specific.

30:01.826 --> 30:05.288
[SPEAKER_01]: I think people know that, you know, it's going to be interesting no matter what.

30:05.308 --> 30:12.110
[SPEAKER_01]: Because we're not talking about like, oh, this match that X, Y, and Z. It's like, no, we're going to hit that this is our topical show.

30:12.150 --> 30:12.771
[SPEAKER_01]: So all right.

30:12.891 --> 30:13.031
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

30:13.552 --> 30:14.338
[SPEAKER_01]: That's it from here.

30:14.419 --> 30:15.829
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks Paul Fontaine.

30:15.970 --> 30:18.750
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm double G. We'll see when we see you peace out.